1994 VS1400 project bike won't roll

[mauricedonini]

Hi,

Recently picked up a 1994 Vs1400 project bike. Hasn't run in a long time.

Starting a couple of days ago the bike is no longer able to roll.

The neutral light doesn't work and I'm not sure if it's in neutral or any gear. Shifting seems to go only between first and second gear.

It's not the brakes. The rear brake is off. The problem persists if the front brake is removed.

After this problem started, the clutch master/slave cylinder has been bled. No improvement.

It feels internal - possibly clutch, transmission or final drive.

Drained the oil. No metal parts/pieces in the oil.

Going to check the clutch plates/housing - maybe there's something in there.

Anyone else have this issue?

Anything else I should check?

Thank you,

Maurice

[Designer]

After reading what you post as symptoms and that it has sat for a long time,...I'm guessing you might have a Stuck Clutch Pack.

Assuming the Clutch Hydraulic System bleed makes the Clutch Release workings is fine, it is probably best to go with your Diagnosis and into the Clutch itself and see what you find.

[mauricedonini]

Thanks Designer

[hillsy]

You might very well have stuck clutch plates - but that is not the problem here.

It is a gearbox / shifter issue if you cant find neutral. The clutch has no bearing on this.

Are you sure you have it in first gear? Maybe you are trying to shift between higher gears? If you can lift the bike and have the rear wheel off the ground then it's easier to rock the wheel back and forth and run through the gears by hand.

Another possibility is the final drive has locked - if you try and roll the bike against the resistance can you get the engine to turn even slightly?

[sgtcall]

You mentioned that the clutch master/slave cylinder has been bled, but did you change the fluid completely?

[Designer]

You mentioned that the clutch master/slave cylinder has been bled, but did you change the fluid completely?

Good point there, I assumed that was what he did. Your focus is spot on.
It is foundational to have a Free Moving, Properly Operational Clutch that Releases/Operates as it should. After that is confirmed, other problems may/may not appear. Not getting it to shift gears very well could be a Gear Shifting Linkage issue(s).

[hillsy]

Guys - he can't find neutral - it has nothing to do with the clutch.

[sgtcall]

Guys - he can't find neutral - it has nothing to do with the clutch.

He said it hasn't run in a long time, that could be 10 months or 10 years. If the fluid is to old there will not be enough pressure to engage the clutch properly. Mine was having trouble finding neutral and it was because it had air in the line due to a bad seal at the master cylinder. But it would still go between gears no issue. A master cylinder rebuild kit and new fluid solved the issue.

[sgtcall]

Another point.
Start with the simple things first and work your way to the hard stuff as you go.

Example,
Won't turn over, do you....
a. Tear the engine down.
b. Check the battery and battery connections.
c. Make sure the kill switch is not activated.

[hillsy]

Guys - he can't find neutral - it has nothing to do with the clutch.

He said it hasn't run in a long time, that could be 10 months or 10 years. If the fluid is to old there will not be enough pressure to engage the clutch properly. Mine was having trouble finding neutral and it was because it had air in the line due to a bad seal at the master cylinder. But it would still go between gears no issue. A master cylinder rebuild kit and new fluid solved the issue.

Are you talking about finding neutral while the bike is running?

[sgtcall]

Guys - he can't find neutral - it has nothing to do with the clutch.

He said it hasn't run in a long time, that could be 10 months or 10 years. If the fluid is to old there will not be enough pressure to engage the clutch properly. Mine was having trouble finding neutral and it was because it had air in the line due to a bad seal at the master cylinder. But it would still go between gears no issue. A master cylinder rebuild kit and new fluid solved the issue.

Are you talking about finding neutral while the bike is running?

Running or not finding neutral when the clutch had no pressure was a PIA.

[hillsy]

Guys - he can't find neutral - it has nothing to do with the clutch.

He said it hasn't run in a long time, that could be 10 months or 10 years. If the fluid is to old there will not be enough pressure to engage the clutch properly. Mine was having trouble finding neutral and it was because it had air in the line due to a bad seal at the master cylinder. But it would still go between gears no issue. A master cylinder rebuild kit and new fluid solved the issue.

Are you talking about finding neutral while the bike is running?

Running or not finding neutral when the clutch had no pressure was a PIA.

You should be able to find neutral easily if the bike is not running regardless of whether the clutch pack is stuck or not. There is no pressure on the gear train when the bike is not running - although you might need to "rock" the back wheel to allow the shift forks to release.

Engaging or disengaging the clutch when the bike is NOT running will have no effect on shifting gears.

[mauricedonini]

Hi,

couple of clarifications.

clutch fluid was flushed and replaced with new fluid.

This bike hasn't run in at least 5 years.

The only electrics working are the headlight, horn & turn signals.

39,xxx miles.

It did roll from the PO's garage to the trailer and from the trailer to it's current home.

I'm going to start with the clutch system because it can be done with the engine still in the bike.

thanks for the help,

Maurice

[Designer]

Hi, couple of clarifications.
clutch fluid was flushed and replaced with new fluid.
This bike hasn't run in at least 5 years.
The only electrics working are the headlight, horn & turn signals.
39,xxx miles.
It did roll from the PO's garage to the trailer and from the trailer to it's current home.
I'm going to start with the clutch system because it can be done with the engine still in the bike.
thanks for the help, Maurice

You are most Welcome, Maurice.

And thanks loads for the additional information. The more we know, the better will be our help to you.

Best to check the Linkage next.

We will await your Updates. Hope all goes well.

[Herb]

Is your bike a 4 speed transmission?

[mauricedonini]

Hi

It’s a four speed

The problem is half solved.

Lubed up the gear shifter. Now it moves through first , neutral and second.

It rolls when in neutral, however does not roll when in gear and the clutch lever pulled in.

Continuing on with plan A. Opening up the clutch and checking out the plates as well as the other components.

Your help is appreciated.

Thank you

Maurice

[Designer]

The problem is half solved.
Lubed up the gear shifter. Now it moves through first , neutral and second.
It rolls when in neutral, however does not roll when in gear and the clutch lever pulled in.

Very Good News! Much as I had thought, the shifting problem would have been lack of lube in the linkage.

Continuing on with plan A. Opening up the clutch and checking out the plates as well as the other components. Your help is appreciated. Thank you Maurice

Good call,...now let's get to what was suggested a few days ago and take care of that. Having a Fully Functional Clutch will mean you will always be able to make it roll, which was your first-stated issue of concern.
viewtopic.php?f=10&t=13605&start=1
I'm wanting to get you Back On The Road Again.

[hillsy]

It rolls when in neutral, however does not roll when in gear and the clutch lever pulled in.

This is pretty much normal for a bike that has been sitting - some bikes will act like this even from sitting overnight.

Glad you found the problem - there is no way the clutch being locked would have stopped you from finding neutral.

You are probably best off pulling the clutch plates out and cleaning them if the bike has sat for 5 years. Always put a layer of fresh engine oil between the cleaned plates before you re-assemble (IE: never re-pack them dry).

[Herb]

The problem is half solved.
Lubed up the gear shifter. Now it moves through first , neutral and second.
It rolls when in neutral, however does not roll when in gear and the clutch lever pulled in.

Very Good News! Much as I had thought, the shifting problem would have been lack of lube in the linkage.

Continuing on with plan A. Opening up the clutch and checking out the plates as well as the other components. Your help is appreciated. Thank you Maurice

Good call,...now let's get to what was suggested a few days ago and take care of that. Having a Fully Functional Clutch will mean you will always be able to make it roll, which was your first-stated issue of concern.
viewtopic.php?f=10&t=13605&start=1
I'm wanting to get you Back On The Road Again.

My bike is hard to move when in gear and cold. It eve cranks hard when starting cold, in gear. With cold oil the clutch drags...

Just about every bike I have owned the clutch would drag when the oil was cold.

[Designer]

The problem is half solved.
Lubed up the gear shifter. Now it moves through first , neutral and second.
It rolls when in neutral, however does not roll when in gear and the clutch lever pulled in.

Very Good News! Much as I had thought, the shifting problem would have been lack of lube in the linkage.

Continuing on with plan A. Opening up the clutch and checking out the plates as well as the other components. Your help is appreciated. Thank you Maurice

Good call,...now let's get to what was suggested a few days ago and take care of that. Having a Fully Functional Clutch will mean you will always be able to make it roll, which was your first-stated issue of concern.
viewtopic.php?f=10&t=13605&start=1
I'm wanting to get you Back On The Road Again.

My bike is hard to move when in gear and cold. It eve cranks hard when starting cold, in gear. With cold oil the clutch drags...

Just about every bike I have owned the clutch would drag when the oil was cold.

Yup,.....mine's like that too. When warmed, it moves alot easier. But at least he could make it roll if he needed to by just pulling in the Clutch.

The Fundamental issue he is having is The Clutch. Fixing that will certainly beget him being able to get the bike to roll again, and needs be done to get the Bike roadworthy anyways.

Having a Final Drive or Gearbox issue was pretty remote, if at all. Thank goodness!