Intruders-Alert

I’m at my breaking point with this bike, I don’t know what else there is to try, I cannot and I mean cannot get the bike to idle on both cylinders the closest I can possibly come is screwing in the thumb screw all the way, and backing out the sync cable all the way out till it’s just pulling the front carb open and then it maybe will run on both cylinders, the rear carb lights up every time almost no matter what. I have removed the front carb twice now and cleaned the pilot jets and entire circuit as thoroughly as humanly possible and it makes no difference. Spark is wonderful on both cyls float height has been triple checked absolutely getting fuel, usually there is something I feel I can re-check and tweak but not this time. screwing with the fuel mixture screws does absolutely nothing. If anyone lives in Phoenix let me know I need help.

Deedubforum wrote: ↑

Thu Nov 09, 2023 9:58 pm

I’m at my breaking point with this bike, I don’t know what else there is to try, I cannot and I mean cannot get the bike to idle on both cylinders the closest I can possibly come is screwing in the thumb screw all the way, and backing out the sync cable all the way out till it’s just pulling the front carb open and then it maybe will run on both cylinders, the rear carb lights up every time almost no matter what. I have removed the front carb twice now and cleaned the pilot jets and entire circuit as thoroughly as humanly possible and it makes no difference. Spark is wonderful on both cyls float height has been triple checked absolutely getting fuel, usually there is something I feel I can re-check and tweak but not this time. screwing with the fuel mixture screws does absolutely nothing. If anyone lives in Phoenix let me know I need help.

Rockdoc is somewhere out there.

Rockdoc wrote: ↑

Sat Jun 10, 2023 5:41 pm

Have you checked the intake rubber for leaks? Sounds like it might be sucking in air if everything else is done.

hillsy v2 wrote: ↑

Fri Nov 10, 2023 12:18 am

Have you checked the intake rubber for leaks? Sounds like it might be sucking in air if everything else is done.

I’ll check that, right now there’s no air filters on just open carb maybe that’s an issue? Just doesn’t seem like it, I’ve ran so many bikes in the past without a filter just for testing purposes and they’ve been fine

I don't know about the 800's but the 1400's don't like to run without a filter

Herb wrote: ↑

Fri Nov 10, 2023 8:46 am

I don't know about the 800's but the 1400's don't like to run without a filter

I’ll try to hook it up somehow not super hopeful but I’ll come back w results, what are some other processes of elimination I can try? Don’t wanna throw in the towel on this bike.

Let's bring in some more experts.

Lechy wrote: ↑

Wed Apr 05, 2023 11:08 pm

navigator wrote: ↑

Mon Apr 03, 2023 8:45 am

WintrSol wrote: ↑

Mon Apr 03, 2023 12:25 pm

hillsy v2 wrote: ↑

Mon Apr 03, 2023 2:21 pm

Designer wrote: ↑

Tue Apr 04, 2023 8:17 pm

NCDave ended up sending his carbs off for a complete rebuild. You may want to check out his thread on his rebuild for some ideas.

viewtopic.php?f=47&t=14023&hilit=ncdave

Deedubforum wrote: ↑

Fri Nov 10, 2023 8:16 am

hillsy v2 wrote: ↑

Fri Nov 10, 2023 12:18 am

Have you checked the intake rubber for leaks? Sounds like it might be sucking in air if everything else is done.

I’ll check that, right now there’s no air filters on just open carb maybe that’s an issue? Just doesn’t seem like it, I’ve ran so many bikes in the past without a filter just for testing purposes and they’ve been fine

Can you put your hand over the carb intake to see it that makes a difference? If it's a fuelling issue this will help the carb suck in more fuel.

hillsy v2 wrote: ↑

Fri Nov 10, 2023 1:55 pm

Deedubforum wrote: ↑

Fri Nov 10, 2023 8:16 am

hillsy v2 wrote: ↑

Fri Nov 10, 2023 12:18 am

Have you checked the intake rubber for leaks? Sounds like it might be sucking in air if everything else is done.

I’ll check that, right now there’s no air filters on just open carb maybe that’s an issue? Just doesn’t seem like it, I’ve ran so many bikes in the past without a filter just for testing purposes and they’ve been fine

Can you put your hand over the carb intake to see it that makes a difference? If it's a fuelling issue this will help the carb suck in more fuel.

Yes I think I tried that and it did something I’ll retry today and see exactly what it does. To make sure.

Okay so slight update, I threw some pod filters I had on, and this seemed to help, I was finally able to get the front to catch up, a few things of concern though are 1. The mixture screw on the front carb has to be turned out appropriately 6 times which seems excessive to me but it functions (too far out stumbling/too far in). I’m assuming it means the idle passages are still partially blocked which I’m not sure how that’s conceivable at this point but anyway. I also noticed after shutting off the bike a small amount of white smoke slowly billows out from the front exhaust any word on what that could be? Here’s a pic and yes I’m aware the fuel supply is not safe; neither is riding a motorcycle not gonna get my hopes up too high but just hoping I don’t need serious engine work.

The 800's will not run correctly unless the air filters and air boxes are fitted. Pods need to be covered with filter foam to emulate the drag caused by the filter system.

I made a tool for checking vacuum leaks and introducing fuel to a lean cylinder out of one of these


It is a solid ox welding kit It uses a soled pellet that when ignited provided oxygen for the propane torch for welding

I just cut the tray for the pellet pulled the hoses apart and joined them with aa fitting
I like it because of the pinpoint tip I can direct a very small amount of propane to a small area around the suspected area
Or I can turn up the propane for an extra fuel source
I have made other similar tools but they where a little clunky

Any propane system can be made to work
keep in mind the tighter the flow at the end of the hose the better the tool will work for locating the smallest vacuum leaks

If you cover the throat of the suspected carb and the idle improves then I would look for a vacuum leak
As hillsy mentioned it suggest a lean condition

Also you need some resistance at the trouts of your carbs to operate the slides as mentioned by Lechy

PS
These can be really expensive

This one is 39 dollars on eBay and up to 199,00

FallenAngel wrote: ↑

Fri Nov 10, 2023 7:39 pm

PS
These can be really expensive

This one is 39 dollars on eBay and up to 199,00

You think I could just use my oxy acetylene torch on a low setting?

Deedubforum wrote: ↑

Fri Nov 10, 2023 9:46 pm

You think I could just use my oxy acetylene torch on a low setting?

Sure
you will want to cut the tip off of the pipe and taper the hose to about a 8 th inch
The small diameter out let lets you pin point the leak

Something that is easy to check and might be a contributing factor,...check the tightness of the Exhaust Flange Bolts to make sure there are no leaks.


Seems your reporting/testing points to a strong possible Idle Circuit problem. In that Circuit, the most likely point any debris/crud can cause issues is where it is the smallest...that being, right at the tip of the Idle Mixture Screw. I might suggest you carefully extract it and it's Tension Screw and spray some Penetrating Oil in there, ( to help soften/loosen and possible crud) Let it sit do it's "magic" for a half hour,.. then perform a couple of cleanings with Carb/Choke Cleaner or Brake Cleaner. Reassemble, adjust as per Spec, and see if that makes an improvement. If so, You might run it for a while and see if the problem re-occurs. If it does, then it's probably time to Rebuild/Super Clean the Carbs again.

Lechy wrote: ↑

Fri Nov 10, 2023 6:56 pm

The 800's will not run correctly unless the air filters and air boxes are fitted. Pods need to be covered with filter foam to emulate the drag caused by the filter system.

What Lechy says. These are CV carbs and need good vacuum to lift the slides.

Designer wrote: ↑

Sat Nov 11, 2023 5:52 am

Something that is easy to check and might be a contributing factor,...check the tightness of the Exhaust Flange Bolts to make sure there are no leaks.


Seems your reporting/testing points to a strong possible Idle Circuit problem. In that Circuit, the most likely point any debris/crud can cause issues is where it is the smallest...that being, right at the tip of the Idle Mixture Screw. I might suggest you carefully extract it and it's Tension Screw and spray some Penetrating Oil in there, ( to help soften/loosen and possible crud) Let it sit do it's "magic" for a half hour,.. then perform a couple of cleanings with Carb/Choke Cleaner or Brake Cleaner. Reassemble, adjust as per Spec, and see if that makes an improvement. If so, You might run it for a while and see if the problem re-occurs. If it does, then it's probably time to Rebuild/Super Clean the Carbs again.

When you say idle mixture screw are you referring to the one you have to remove the plug on? All mine is is a screw with spring washer and o ring there’s no tension screw?

Deedubforum wrote: ↑

Sat Nov 11, 2023 10:51 am

Designer wrote: ↑

Sat Nov 11, 2023 5:52 am

Something that is easy to check and might be a contributing factor,...check the tightness of the Exhaust Flange Bolts to make sure there are no leaks.


Seems your reporting/testing points to a strong possible Idle Circuit problem. In that Circuit, the most likely point any debris/crud can cause issues is where it is the smallest...that being, right at the tip of the Idle Mixture Screw. I might suggest you carefully extract it and it's Tension Screw and spray some Penetrating Oil in there, ( to help soften/loosen and possible crud) Let it sit do it's "magic" for a half hour,.. then perform a couple of cleanings with Carb/Choke Cleaner or Brake Cleaner. Reassemble, adjust as per Spec, and see if that makes an improvement. If so, You might run it for a while and see if the problem re-occurs. If it does, then it's probably time to Rebuild/Super Clean the Carbs again.

When you say idle mixture screw are you referring to the one you have to remove the plug on? All mine is is a screw with spring washer and o ring there’s no tension screw?

Yess-SIREE! The Spring to whencest I refer is indeed ,...The Tension Screw.

And ,...that IS the Screw I also referest to.

You are quite correct there, Bro.....TWICE >