My new bike is crap.
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Re: My new bike is crap.
What I was able to find and read about is that the tie rod/link between the shock/spring and frame tends to hammer the frame mounting lugs out until the holes are egged out, and possibly blows out the lug entirely in a worst-case scenario.
But that hammering can only happen when the rear suspension is fully compressed to the stop with no small degree of violence, repeatedly, which would tend to mean running the bike too heavy, too little preload dialed in, extremely bad roads, or abusive riding...or some combo thereof...
But that would be a pretty serious failure, and looking at the parts fiche I can think of several simple ways it could and should have been avoided in the design process. That's odd to leave such a critical point so vulnerable.
To their credit, in the past everything I read had Kaw being criticized (or praised, depending) for building their nakeds and hooligan bikes too robust at the expense of much more weight than their competitors' offerings.
But that hammering can only happen when the rear suspension is fully compressed to the stop with no small degree of violence, repeatedly, which would tend to mean running the bike too heavy, too little preload dialed in, extremely bad roads, or abusive riding...or some combo thereof...
But that would be a pretty serious failure, and looking at the parts fiche I can think of several simple ways it could and should have been avoided in the design process. That's odd to leave such a critical point so vulnerable.
To their credit, in the past everything I read had Kaw being criticized (or praised, depending) for building their nakeds and hooligan bikes too robust at the expense of much more weight than their competitors' offerings.
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Re: My new bike is crap.
Yeah, that was a pretty poor design decision. That area should have been a little beefier. Kaw has developed a bandaid, but if they decide to keep this model in the lineup, I look for a more robust solution in later models. Of course the 17's and early 18's will be the "years to avoid" when purchasing used.jeffcoslacker wrote:What I was able to find and read about is that the tie rod/link between the shock/spring and frame tends to hammer the frame mounting lugs out until the holes are egged out, and possibly blows out the lug entirely in a worst-case scenario.
But that hammering can only happen when the rear suspension is fully compressed to the stop with no small degree of violence, repeatedly, which would tend to mean running the bike too heavy, too little preload dialed in, extremely bad roads, or abusive riding...or some combo thereof...
But that would be a pretty serious failure, and looking at the parts fiche I can think of several simple ways it could and should have been avoided in the design process. That's odd to leave such a critical point so vulnerable.
To their credit, in the past everything I read had Kaw being criticized (or praised, depending) for building their nakeds and hooligan bikes too robust at the expense of much more weight than their competitors' offerings.
I suspect riding in urban area's on a regular basis, such as NYC, DC and Philly, would produce the degree of violence needed to separate the suspension from the frame. (I pick those cities because I've ridden in all three and can attest to the poor road conditions there.)
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Re: My new bike is crap.
If what jeffco posted is right, they'll likely replace the link. Simple fix...
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Re: My new bike is crap.
It's not the link Tim, it's the bracket that holds the link, that's welded to the frame. That's the weak point. Kaw has offered, in other countries, to replace the entire frame if the damage has progressed.Tbeck wrote:If what jeffco posted is right, they'll likely replace the link. Simple fix...
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Re: My new bike is crap.
never mind. I can't find a good link to the pic
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Re: My new bike is crap.
I found it jeffco. According to kawi the shock tie rod end can elongate the bolt holes "if" the shock bottoms out.
It's a 50 minute repair to reenforce the mount. They'll replace frames of some bikes if indicated.
It's not a big deal at all.
It's a 50 minute repair to reenforce the mount. They'll replace frames of some bikes if indicated.
It's not a big deal at all.
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Re: My new bike is crap.
Well, it's possible the 50 minute repair is not a big deal, providing the design issue doesn't move on to the next weak spot. I'm thinking that will probably be the welds.Tbeck wrote:I found it jeffco. According to kawi the shock tie rod end can elongate the bolt holes "if" the shock bottoms out.
It's a 50 minute repair to reenforce the mount. They'll replace frames of some bikes if indicated.
It's not a big deal at all.
Now replacing the frame, sorry, I'm gonna have to disagree, that is a big deal. My bike will probably only need the reinforcement since I haven't put many miles on it and only took it down one bad road.(It rides and handles like crap on marginally paved roads) Wanna buy a low mileage Z900?
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Re: My new bike is crap.
Mattsunn, yah Kawasaki is anticipating some bike's have bottomed out often enough to require a new frame, but it appears that they think that number will be quite small.
From the sounds of the repair Kawasaki is simply beefing up the mount, that welds aren't an issue. I am thinking that it is probably just a "U" shaped shim and new bolt.
What are you finding to be uncomfortable?
From the sounds of the repair Kawasaki is simply beefing up the mount, that welds aren't an issue. I am thinking that it is probably just a "U" shaped shim and new bolt.
What are you finding to be uncomfortable?
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Re: My new bike is crap.
Sport bikes are a lot more firm than most cruisers and soft on a sport will be more like the most firm setting on most cruisers IMO.
My big Nomad was a real nice big cruiser for me.Frank hates his.Only Kaw I ever owned and only 1000 mile day at 1,030 at age 55.We all sure don't like the same thing.I really liked my sportsters solo and did 600+ days on them with ease. I just had two of them but you have had five or six?
My big Nomad was a real nice big cruiser for me.Frank hates his.Only Kaw I ever owned and only 1000 mile day at 1,030 at age 55.We all sure don't like the same thing.I really liked my sportsters solo and did 600+ days on them with ease. I just had two of them but you have had five or six?
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Re: My new bike is crap.
The riding position mostly. When I seat tested this in the showroom I found it to be OK. The pegs weren't as far back as a lot of bikes of this type and the bars were reachable. However, riding it becomes a different story. Hard to explain. Most of my weight is on my wrists and elbows because the seat slides me forward into the tank. Very uncomfortable and actually very painful after only a short ride. I've only been able to ride 25-30 miles at a time, then I have to get off. Another thing that bothers me, has nothing to do with comfort, is the rear suspension is extremely stiff. I have a 12 mile road that I take most of my bikes down to see how they react to various paving conditions. It's a crappy paved road. The rear suspension doesn't react well to the imperfections in this road. It's almost like riding a hardtail. The rear wheel will skip side to side instead of staying on the road. Hard to explain. I've had 2 other bikes that did this, a 650 Vstar Custom and a Sportster 1200S. The Sportster was correctable with suspension adjustments, the 650 probably needed a different spring rate. I think this bike needs a different spring also, but I don't feel like spending the money.Tbeck wrote: What are you finding to be uncomfortable?
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Re: My new bike is crap.
Mattsunn, got it. The Connie did that over reach slide you forward thing. I found a guy who made these 1/8" angled spacers. They move the bar ends up about 1" which fixed that issue by placing them under the bars.
How stiff the seat feels greatly depends on how leaned you are. They're stiff regardless on those bikes.
I dialed the suspension down to eliminate the kick on sharp edge bumps. Check the Z9 forum for advice. I'm sure someone else can help you out with that.
I have some bar risers that MIGHT fit your bike. Does it have the bars like a Connie that bolt to the top clamp? If so I can mail them to you.
Sorry you aren't enjoying it
How stiff the seat feels greatly depends on how leaned you are. They're stiff regardless on those bikes.
I dialed the suspension down to eliminate the kick on sharp edge bumps. Check the Z9 forum for advice. I'm sure someone else can help you out with that.
I have some bar risers that MIGHT fit your bike. Does it have the bars like a Connie that bolt to the top clamp? If so I can mail them to you.
Sorry you aren't enjoying it
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Re: My new bike is crap.
My old ZX9 had an adjustable ride height for the rear shock (seperate to the pre-load) where you could jack it right up and then you would slide along the seat into the tank like you are experiencing. Pretty uncomfortable. I'm thinking people are probably loosening up the pre-load as far as possible on the z900's to try and alleviate this - which in turn is making the shock bottom out and damage the linkages.MattSunn wrote:The riding position mostly. When I seat tested this in the showroom I found it to be OK. The pegs weren't as far back as a lot of bikes of this type and the bars were reachable. However, riding it becomes a different story. Hard to explain. Most of my weight is on my wrists and elbows because the seat slides me forward into the tank. Very uncomfortable and actually very painful after only a short ride. I've only been able to ride 25-30 miles at a time, then I have to get off. Another thing that bothers me, has nothing to do with comfort, is the rear suspension is extremely stiff. I have a 12 mile road that I take most of my bikes down to see how they react to various paving conditions. It's a crappy paved road. The rear suspension doesn't react well to the imperfections in this road. It's almost like riding a hardtail. The rear wheel will skip side to side instead of staying on the road. Hard to explain. I've had 2 other bikes that did this, a 650 Vstar Custom and a Sportster 1200S. The Sportster was correctable with suspension adjustments, the 650 probably needed a different spring rate. I think this bike needs a different spring also, but I don't feel like spending the money.Tbeck wrote: What are you finding to be uncomfortable?
Also, the z900 is pretty sporty as far as running gear goes - a 180 sport rear tyre will never be compliant on bumpy / irregular road surfaces like a narrower dual sport tyre will. Not that you probaly cant make it better, but by it's nature it wont be the best option for rough stuff.
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Re: My new bike is crap.
Hated. Past tense. I sold it because each time I saw it I had to fight the urge to kick the living shit out of it. [emoji2]old time rider wrote:Sport bikes are a lot more firm than most cruisers and soft on a sport will be more like the most firm setting on most cruisers IMO.
My big Nomad was a real nice big cruiser for me.Frank hates his.Only Kaw I ever owned and only 1000 mile day at 1,030 at age 55.We all sure don't like the same thing.I really liked my sportsters solo and did 600+ days on them with ease. I just had two of them but you have had five or six?
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Re: My new bike is crap.
I've had 19 Sportsters. I liked 18 of them. Never could cozy up to the 05 1200R. I still have 3, a 2000,a 2002 and a 2013. The one I liked to tour on was a 2000 xl1200. Mid controls, not much chrome, buckhorn bars. I put highway pegs, luggage rack and sissybar, Sundowner seat and left the long suspension on it. It was a great bike. Sold it to try something different. Should not have done that. I had a 1500 Nomad and a 1500 Classic. Great looking bikes and I loved that engine. But I could never get them to fit just right.old time rider wrote:I really liked my sportsters solo and did 600+ days on them with ease. I just had two of them but you have had five or six?
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Re: My new bike is crap.
Thanks for the offer Tim, but I think I'm going to leave it stock and keep trying to sell it. I think the thing that aggravates me is this issue with the suspension. It's definitely gonna affect resale value and the overall desirability of this bike. Generally, I don't regret buying this bike because I wanted to try something new and different. But the suspension issue has kind of reduced my options of moving on from it.Tbeck wrote:Mattsunn, got it. The Connie did that over reach slide you forward thing. I found a guy who made these 1/8" angled spacers. They move the bar ends up about 1" which fixed that issue by placing them under the bars.
How stiff the seat feels greatly depends on how leaned you are. They're stiff regardless on those bikes.
I dialed the suspension down to eliminate the kick on sharp edge bumps. Check the Z9 forum for advice. I'm sure someone else can help you out with that.
I have some bar risers that MIGHT fit your bike. Does it have the bars like a Connie that bolt to the top clamp? If so I can mail them to you.
Sorry you aren't enjoying it
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Re: My new bike is crap.
The bike kinda shines on a good road with some curves in it. That would be fun if the bike were more comfortable. In addition to to it's poor performance on marginal roads, it's also not so great on the open highway. Gearing is too closely spaced, and honestly, if it wasn't for the gear indicator, I wouldn't know what gear I was in. 4th, 5th and 6th all feel the same. There is no happy place out on the highway. I think the bike would be a better all rounder with an actual 6th gear overdrive.hillsy wrote:
My old ZX9 had an adjustable ride height for the rear shock (seperate to the pre-load) where you could jack it right up and then you would slide along the seat into the tank like you are experiencing. Pretty uncomfortable. I'm thinking people are probably loosening up the pre-load as far as possible on the z900's to try and alleviate this - which in turn is making the shock bottom out and damage the linkages.
Also, the z900 is pretty sporty as far as running gear goes - a 180 sport rear tyre will never be compliant on bumpy / irregular road surfaces like a narrower dual sport tyre will. Not that you probaly cant make it better, but by it's nature it wont be the best option for rough stuff.
I understand what you're saying about the tires, there really isn't any sidewall flex. And I understand it's that way for a reason. But I think a little more compliant suspension on a bike that is not a full on sportbike is a good compromise.
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Re: My new bike is crap.
No doubt a brand name rear shock would be a huge improvement over what is in there now. These sort of naked / muscle / hooligan bikes are usually built down to a price point with the over-riding theme being about aggressive, sporty looks at the expense of real world rideability and highway capability.
Maybe the z1000 would be more to your liking from a riders' perspective?
Maybe the z1000 would be more to your liking from a riders' perspective?
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Re: My new bike is crap.
Mattsunn, do me a favor, if you are set on getting rid of it, and you find something more to your liking but you're going to take a big hit trading, shoot me a PM. I have a friend who owns two MC store's. He sells all the metric brands and Indian. I am 100% sure you could get a better deal from him and I would be happy to try and help out. Maybe an Indian?
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Re: My new bike is crap.
A scout may be enough like a sportster to be a keeper?
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Re: My new bike is crap.
Crap. Crap? As in Jap crap? Hell, I been saying that for over 50 years!
Uh oh. Incoming. Better cover!
Uh oh. Incoming. Better cover!
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